Experimenting with HHO (hydrogen on demand)

I wanted to discuss yet another alternative energy source which I have been working on. The HHO Generator. This has been controversial as people make ridiculous claims of "running their cars on water". I can't... it is more of an combustion fuel additive. It will supplement petrol or diesel and will help to fully burn more efficiently and thus gives better mileage. I envy the users in the UK as they don't have the EPA we have here in the states hindering our efforts <lol> These generators can also be used for heaters & torches.
Initially, I had a wet cell which is basically a Jar with stainless steel & baking soda, or some version of it.



I had this cell in my 1974 VW Beetle and it did well. I went from 24 MPG to just over 32 MPG. But it was bulky.
They have come a long way since then. I use a dry cell and the electrolyte is KOH.



This unit is slated to go into my 4 door Ford Sport Trac pickup truck. It's a 4.0 liter V6 automatic.



Currently the best overall mileage I get is 16 MPG. My endeavor is to get 23 MPG. It isn't as simple as the VW since this truck has an ECU & 02 sensors that will fight the enhancement. I will compensate by installing a MAF enhancer, 02 extenders, and possibly an EFIE.
If anyone has any interest in discussing this power option, let me know. I have done a lot of experimentation and I may be able to save you some frustration.

[Gotwind Ben]

Interesting experiments there Andy.
I admit I haven't looked into 'hydrogen on demand' and still don't fully understand the concept.

Hopefully we will get some interest on the subject here, if it is well recieved I can create a new forum section as you suggested.

What I will do is post some of the builds for this project.

My Dry Cell is a much more clean & compact design. Designed and constructed from plates that are precision cut 3" X 7" Corrosion Resistant High Moly Stainless Steel. The plates are cross hatch and rotary sanded to promote bubble release and then cleansed in an Ultrasonic cleaner at 40,000 Hz leaving them microscopically clean. The plates are sealed between high temperature 1/16" thick EPDM gaskets. I did not use automotive grade gaskets as they are inadequate. The end plates are manufactured from 1/2" high grade, high temperature Cast Acrylic. The end plates measure only 4-3/16" X 7-3/4" so the unit will fit anywhere. They are held in place with 1/4" X 20 Zinc plated bolts.
This 21 plate cell has a configuration of:

-NNNN+NNNN-NNNN+NNNN-

I rate it at a conservative 15 to 30 Amp's. At those amperes the cell will run without overheating. It won't melt wires or boil the Electrolyte Solution. It also won't overload the alternator.

I used to run a diesel car on cooking oil back when it was illegal and cooking oil was only 31p/ltr versus 85p/ltr for diesel. :oops:
Got a mate now who has a petrol Land-Rover with a gas conversion fitted but instead of using LPG from a petrol station he uses LPG bottled gas with no duty on it. Just connects the bottle straight up. ;)

Big drawback over here though is that when you start to do things like this your insurance becomes void :(

Big drawback over here though is that when you start to do things like this your insurance becomes void :(

Hi Shawn, When you say your insurance becomes void, are you referring to the automobile manufacturers warranty? (some words have different meaning in the sates)
If this is what you are referring to, I personally have not installed an HHO unit on a vehicle which still has the factory warranty, and in no way would it harm the vehicle. It actually helps burn the petrol more efficiently & completely which is one of the ways it helps mileage. Less unburned fuel goes out of the tailpipe. In any case, This system is extremely easy to remove if necessary. The benefits are worth the trouble.

Andy
Not a manufacturer's warranty thing, more like home insurance, but for cars. Insurance companies over here in UK look for any excuse at all to not pay out, even if the modification has nothing whatsoever to do with the claim. Probably the same in the States I would have thought.

I'm very interested in your HHO thing. On the face of it, using a car's alternator to power an electrolysis cell to split water into H2 and O2 to feed into an internal combustion engine to burn to turn the engine to turn the alternator, etc etc, should be a very bad idea energetically, on a full-cycle basis. But you've done it and achieved a significant mpg increase.
I wonder what's happening.

By the way, 16 mpg is normal ???????????????????

Ye Gods and little fishes.

Andy
Not a manufacturer's warranty thing, more like home insurance, but for cars. Insurance companies over here in UK look for any excuse at all to not pay out, even if the modification has nothing whatsoever to do with the claim. Probably the same in the States I would have thought.

I'm very interested in your HHO thing. On the face of it, using a car's alternator to power an electrolysis cell to split water into H2 and O2 to feed into an internal combustion engine to burn to turn the engine to turn the alternator, etc etc, should be a very bad idea energetically, on a full-cycle basis. But you've done it and achieved a significant mpg increase.
I wonder what's happening.

By the way, 16 mpg is normal ???????????????????
Ye Gods and little fishes.

Really? Wow!
We carry insurance on our cars for liability and collision/fire & theft. I guess what you are saying is if your car is stolen or totaled you insurance companies would refuse to reimburse you for your car because it was modified? To me that's like saying if you put high end Pirelli Tires on a Ford Fiesta they would refuse a claim since they were not original equipment tires. In the states there are only 2 downsides to the HHO system.

1. The insurance company would not reimburse you for the cost of the HHO system (but your car is covered)
2. Because of EPA standards, some states will fail you for safety inspection because you modified the pollution control system (even though the car produces less pollution emission gases)

That's one reason this unit is simple to remove for safety emission inspection purposes.

With regard to using the alternator to power the cell, if the intention was to run the car using this as a fuel exclusively, it is not going to happen. The fuel saving comes from the hydrogen gas being able to fully have the petrol combusted. There is no unburned fuel going out of the tail pipe. The emissions are much cleaner.
The issue with the newer vehicles is that adding HHO will give the ECU a reading of a lean burn condition, and the ECU will try to compensate by adding more fuel. That is why an EFIE, MAF enhancer,or custom ECU re tune is required.

Unfortunately 16 MPG is normal for this truck (and it is not a full size pickup) It is basically the same size as the Ford Ranger WildTrak, without the option of being diesel.


It appears fuel efficiency is not intended for the USA

One of the components that I am using to prevent the ECU from reading a lean burn condition is a MAF Enhancer. This is what sends air flow information in voltage to your ECU (computer). Some vehicles send frequency. You will have to refer to your service manual. on my Ford 4.0 it's voltage only. This unit will not work for frequency MAF sensors



This is the "birds nest" wiring. All the components I bought at Radio Shack. I placed the arrangement in a project box for now but I think in the end I will do a custom install in the dash or the console. All it will take is to drill 5 holes in total.


This BLUE with the RED stripe wire is the MAF sensor wire to the ECU. FORD ONLY. This is the wire you need to cut. I found this information by looking at the shop manual. I suggest you refer to your car's service manual.



Make your connection by cutting off the MAF to ECU wire and connecting the Yellow wire from your enhancer going to the MAF. The Black wire from your enhancer will connect to the other end of the wire (that you just cut) that is still connected to the ECU.
The Green wire is for ground. Note: You only cut one wire under your hood.
Mount your enhancer on the dash, or console. Your car is now wired and ready to go.
The White Wire is used as a manual shut-off for your generator; this wire is used as a ground when you connect it to a relay that is wired to the pin #85 on
relay. When you switch from Hybrid to Factory your MAF will return to factory settings and your generator will shut off.



This is the basic hookup to the HHO system in your car.

[Gotwind Ben]

It would be interesting to see what mpg you could increase some of the latest super efficient diesel cars to.
The VW polo 'blue motion' springs to mind at 70 mpg untouched.
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews ... _polo.html

I read the 3 cylinder diesel engines are woefully slow as you would imagine.

It would be interesting to see what mpg you could increase some of the latest super efficient diesel cars to.
The VW polo 'blue motion' springs to mind at 70 mpg untouched.
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews ... _polo.html

I read the 3 cylinder diesel engines are woefully slow as you would imagine.

Unfortunately, I don't think I will ever see one in person. The U.S. may likely get the Polo at some point (but I highly doubt it) :cry: